Rick Warren: Stopping Evil ‘Is The Legitimate Role Of Government’
Rick Warren: Stopping Evil ‘Is The Legitimate Role Of Government’
Appearing on Fox’s Hannity and Colmes last night to promote his new book, Pastor Rick Warren made a brief foray into foreign policy. Responding to Hannity’s assertion that “we need to take him [Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad] out,” Warren agreed, saying that stopping evil “is the legitimate role of government. The Bible says that God puts government on earth to punish evildoers.”
Watch it:
Does Warren really consider it part of his ministry to sanctify the inch-deep theologizing-cum-warmongering of thugs like Sean Hannity? If so, who else does Warren think Jesus would bomb?
I contacted Pastor Warren’s office for clarification, specifically to find out where, exactly, the Bible says that “God puts government on earth to punish evildoers” like Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. They said they’d get back to me. I’ll update if and when they do. I suspect Warren was referring to Romans 13, in which the Apostle Paul admonished Christians to submit to governing authorities (Hear that Hannity? Submit!), and also addressed the power of civil government to punish criminals. This has nothing to do, as far as I know, with invading foreign countries and killing their leaders, which is the context in which Warren is speaking.
In any case, if this were a conversation between an Iranian TV host and an ayatollah in which they discussed scriptural justifications for “taking out” high ranking members of the U.S. government, you’d probably see Sean Hannity running the clip on his show — while slowly shaking his head in pious disapproval — as evidence of what crazy extremists those Iranians are. As it is, they’ll probably be running this on Iranian TV as evidence of what crazy extremists those Americans are.
Transcript:
HANNITY: Can you talk to rogue dictators? Ahmadinejad denies the Holocaust, wants to wipe Israel off the map, is seeking nuclear weapons.
WARREN: Yes.
HANNITY: I think we need to take him out.
WARREN: Yes.
HANNITY: Am I advocating something dark, evil or something righteous?
WARREN: Well, actually, the Bible says that evil cannot be negotiated with. It has to just be stopped. And I believe…
HANNITY: By force?
WARREN: Well, if necessary. In fact, that is the legitimate role of government. The Bible says that God puts government on earth to punish evildoers. Not good-doers. Evildoers.
HANNITY: I’m just gotten, thanks to my wife, who you know, you know, been reading the Old Testament. Because as a good Catholic growing up, I studied more the New Testament.
WARREN: Just ignored that part.
HANNITY: I ignored the Old Testament. But what about King David? What about the — all the battles, all the conflict, you know, going back - - you know, Abraham — Adam and Eve and their children, going forward?
WARREN: The point is, there are some things worth dying for. There’s no doubt about that. And I would die for my family. I would die for my freedom. I would die for this country.
HANNITY: If somebody broke into your house, you would be justified to kill them?
WARREN: I would be justified to protect my family. Absolutely.
HANNITY: And if it took killing them?
WARREN: Absolutely.
HANNITY: But it’s not murder at that point?
WARREN: No. Murder is not self-defense.
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6 Responses to “Rick Warren: Stopping Evil ‘Is The Legitimate Role Of Government’”
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There’s one major problem here. Romans 13:1-3 says this:
Then isn’t Warren actually arguing against the Bible when he suggests that we should take Ahmadinejad out? After all, if you accept this argument on its face, then wouldn’t Ahmadinejad also be a “ruler” who is “not a terro to good works”? Or does Rick think God doesn’t rule over Iran?
Warren’s theological thought process is only a step above Hannity’s…
December 4th, 2008 at 5:09 pmYou also have the end of verse 1: “The authorities that exist have been established by God.” Let’s see, Ahmadinejad is the authority in Iran, just like Saddam was the authority in Iraq. Therefore they must be established by God. Warren apparently knows more then God and plans to “correct” God. Very interesting. Sounds like someone else in the bible….
December 5th, 2008 at 3:14 pmwe need to take him [Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad] out,” Warren agreed
In-group morality at it’s finest. There always has to be an enemy, even if innocents have to suffer, since “innocent” doesn’t have meaning for the out-group. Self-glorification is always the end goal.
December 17th, 2008 at 7:00 pmGod doesn’t really have total control over people; he places people in power and then complains when they go too far. Remember the Prophets — Israel was sinning, so Yahweh (God) sent Nebuchadrezzar to destroy everything. But then it turned out he’d destroyed too much, and the other countries around had also destroyed too much, so Yahweh decided to punish them, too.
In other words: Biblical theology on God and politics is all over the place. There’s not much you CAN’T say, one way or the other, about what things Yahweh put there and what things other people put there that pissed Yahweh off. It’s a fairly difficult question, since it involves the question of free will, and the ancient Israelites and Jews who wrote the Bible certainly didn’t answer it in the book. They can’t even agree on whether there are any other gods besides Yahweh, just that, if there are, worshipping them is about the worst possible thing you can do. So Rick Warren is definitely contradicting the Bible somewhere, and he’s definitely in agreement with it somewhere else. That’s what you get for relying on such a diverse collection of mostly badly-written (and badly-translated, often) ancient texts instead of millennia of rational thinking and moral reasoning.
The point is that the guy’s a homophobe.
December 17th, 2008 at 7:04 pm“The Bible says that God puts government on earth to punish evildoers.”
President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, being the legitimate head of state must be God’s will. It is Ahmadinejad’s role to remove evil. If the U.S. was to topple his government, the U.S. would be going against the will of God, which would be evil.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:10 pmI’m amazed I let Pastor Rick’s surprising comment get by me. Its pretty relevant now that he’ll be doing Obama’s invocation at the inaugural.
Anyway, regardless of a thin and uncharacteristically unsettling view of scripture, I think it also betrays Warren’s lack of foreign policy understanding.
Put aside the moral and legal issues with a US-government supported policy for assassination …. what would killing Ahmadinejad even accomplish?! He’s just the president, not the Supreme Leader! I love how the right wing always seem to overlook the fact that Ahmadinejad, while powerful fairly powerful in the Iranian domestic economy, has some pretty big limits on Iran’s affairs abroad. If we kill or advocate as a nation killing anyone in Iran (much less most countries around the world), we’ll just end up with more BLOWBACK. See Operation Ajax and our ouster of Iran’s genuinely democratic Prime Minister Mossedaq in 1953.
Strong national defense and continuing our push to limit Iran’s nuclear ambitions is one thing, but what the heck Pastor Rick?!
A lot of Iranians are embarrassed by Amadinejad anyway, hopefully he’ll lose next June’s election.
Ugh.
December 18th, 2008 at 9:37 pm